Pineapple
12-14 02:16 PM
I agree with alterego.
There is another compelling argument against taking the lawsuit way, even if assuming there is a case to be made, and we have plenty of money. (The first is unclear, the second is a firm no, but let us assume anyway for the sake or argument)
One of the reasons why Roe v Wade, 34 years on, is still a controversial decision today is the fact that the US is probably unique in the world in the sense that a constitutionality argument was used to decide public policy.
In Europe, as in other parts of the world, abortion was considered as a health issue, and handled via legislation and health care guidelines.
But because it was a constitutionality issue in US, and enforced from the bench, a significant portion of the populace felt left out of the decision making process, which stimulated a simmering opposition and entrenched the main actors of the "culture wars", which persist to this day.
There is significant debate even among liberals whether Roe V Wade has helped or harmed the liberal cause, and if knowing what we know, there could have been another approach to achieve the same end.
In a nutshell, approaching the courts is a double edged sword. There may be some strategic gains in the short term, but the long term impact is unclear and unpredictable. A legislative approach might be slower and incremental, but it is less risky.
Think of lobbying as polite negotiation.
Think of Supreme court case as picking a fist fight, in which we are badly out numbered.
Once you have started a fist fight it is much harder to negotiate, especially from a loosing position.
This is exactly correct. It is not the question of right or wrong here. That is what gets folks so upset on this thread, they feel since their viewpoint s right then.......... Most neutral observers like mbartosik can see this as unjust and there may be many in the US as well, however certainly not the majority. However, there are many ways in which this could backfire. One example is the recently seen debate over illegal immigration and the turn in public sentiment. Truth be told, if someone did something wrong 12 yrs ago(crossed the fence), now is married to a US citizen and has 3 US children, what do you do with them? What about the 3yr old who was brought to the USA by their parents and knows no other system? Perhaps a few years ago joe public would have given them a pass, no more, the debate has become so nasty that positions have been hardened to the point that reason does not prevail. Another reason has something to do with the perceived sense of entitlement Americans sensed in the illegal immigrant community(of course fanned by Lou Dobbs and his ilk). These are complex issues and generally you will get a lot further appealing to someones sense of fairness than explaining how you are entitled to something and will take it from them if it is not given to you.
There is another compelling argument against taking the lawsuit way, even if assuming there is a case to be made, and we have plenty of money. (The first is unclear, the second is a firm no, but let us assume anyway for the sake or argument)
One of the reasons why Roe v Wade, 34 years on, is still a controversial decision today is the fact that the US is probably unique in the world in the sense that a constitutionality argument was used to decide public policy.
In Europe, as in other parts of the world, abortion was considered as a health issue, and handled via legislation and health care guidelines.
But because it was a constitutionality issue in US, and enforced from the bench, a significant portion of the populace felt left out of the decision making process, which stimulated a simmering opposition and entrenched the main actors of the "culture wars", which persist to this day.
There is significant debate even among liberals whether Roe V Wade has helped or harmed the liberal cause, and if knowing what we know, there could have been another approach to achieve the same end.
In a nutshell, approaching the courts is a double edged sword. There may be some strategic gains in the short term, but the long term impact is unclear and unpredictable. A legislative approach might be slower and incremental, but it is less risky.
Think of lobbying as polite negotiation.
Think of Supreme court case as picking a fist fight, in which we are badly out numbered.
Once you have started a fist fight it is much harder to negotiate, especially from a loosing position.
This is exactly correct. It is not the question of right or wrong here. That is what gets folks so upset on this thread, they feel since their viewpoint s right then.......... Most neutral observers like mbartosik can see this as unjust and there may be many in the US as well, however certainly not the majority. However, there are many ways in which this could backfire. One example is the recently seen debate over illegal immigration and the turn in public sentiment. Truth be told, if someone did something wrong 12 yrs ago(crossed the fence), now is married to a US citizen and has 3 US children, what do you do with them? What about the 3yr old who was brought to the USA by their parents and knows no other system? Perhaps a few years ago joe public would have given them a pass, no more, the debate has become so nasty that positions have been hardened to the point that reason does not prevail. Another reason has something to do with the perceived sense of entitlement Americans sensed in the illegal immigrant community(of course fanned by Lou Dobbs and his ilk). These are complex issues and generally you will get a lot further appealing to someones sense of fairness than explaining how you are entitled to something and will take it from them if it is not given to you.
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viva
01-29 02:51 AM
pappu- i got the message. sorry, if i became overzealous. just wanted to help iv...
i will not raise any more questions asking non-contributing members to contribute.
go iv .....go core team!
i will not raise any more questions asking non-contributing members to contribute.
go iv .....go core team!
matreen
02-12 11:17 PM
Yes, instead of living in dark lets do something about it....enough is enough.
M
M
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acecupid
09-03 01:32 PM
Andhra CM YSR Reddy gave Raju 50 acres for SEZ-Software-Infotech-The Economic Times on Mobile (http://m.economictimes.com/articleshow/4004358.cms)
Ghotala.in � � Do you know that Andhra CM YSR Reddy gave Raju 50 acres of land for IT SEZIndia�s Ghotala / Scandals / Scams News,Information, Updates,Discussions.Satyam Scandal (http://www.ghotala.in/2009/01/20/do-you-know-that-andhra-cm-ysr-reddy-gave-raju-50-acres-of-land-for-it-sez/)
India Retold: COVERING UP THE MOTHER OF ALL CORRUPTION SCANDALS (http://vinodksharma.blogspot.com/2009/02/covering-up-mother-of-all-corruption.html)
Ghotala.in � � Do you know that Andhra CM YSR Reddy gave Raju 50 acres of land for IT SEZIndia�s Ghotala / Scandals / Scams News,Information, Updates,Discussions.Satyam Scandal (http://www.ghotala.in/2009/01/20/do-you-know-that-andhra-cm-ysr-reddy-gave-raju-50-acres-of-land-for-it-sez/)
India Retold: COVERING UP THE MOTHER OF ALL CORRUPTION SCANDALS (http://vinodksharma.blogspot.com/2009/02/covering-up-mother-of-all-corruption.html)
more...
unseenguy
06-12 01:12 AM
You will be considered as anti immigrant if you support any of restriction to H1b or Grassley Bill even if the they are good. Even recapture is passed that will not resolve the problem unless the numbers are huge.Recapture bill will give only limited releif for limited time. If we want all of the problems of High skilled immigration system needs almost unlimited GC numbers and also huge expansion of H1b. That will be nearly impossible for atleast next 5 years or more.
If anyone is having good skills they will escape whatever the restriction they put for H1b. More restriction bad apples will be filtered. If H1b number goes down by restriction waiting time for GC will go down. Most persons will get GC within 2 to 4 years time at the same time best and bright will come here.
So you are indirectly saying, you got GC because you are best and brightest?
If anyone is having good skills they will escape whatever the restriction they put for H1b. More restriction bad apples will be filtered. If H1b number goes down by restriction waiting time for GC will go down. Most persons will get GC within 2 to 4 years time at the same time best and bright will come here.
So you are indirectly saying, you got GC because you are best and brightest?
trramesh
06-15 11:00 AM
For most of the ppl with hateful comments, Reality sucks and bites back. I agree with dilip and unfortunately, among billions voices and opinions dont matter. Just brutal personal attacks.
That said. We cant stop the outsourcing and dumping. Today is biilions from India and china and tomorrow rest of billions from rest of world (like Africa and rest).
If you dont have any proper counter argument, dont post. Period, dont stoop to personal attack.(race,caste,place and commutiy and alma mater).
Grow up folks.
As the saying goes, there are two sides to a coin, and there is definitely some truth in the counter arguments. There are quite a few blood sucking desi consulting cos out there, and those need to be cleansed out to protect our own country men from exploitation.
Coming to the point of GC, it is the US gov that gave H1B and invited these people to come and work here to support its companies. At that point, it did not apply country quota. Now when it comes to adjudicating GCs, this unfair concept exists. The process should be unifiorm and fair. If GC and citizenship needs per country quota, so does H1B. Keep everyone at the same level. How is someone from a non retrogressed country more worthy to US than his counterpart from a retrogressed country.
We cannot change what had already happened, and fortunately or unfortunately, we are here looking to have our future in this country. We also need a clear path to immigration. I think it is the moral responsibility of the US gov to show us just that. If the US gov wants to protect the jobs for its citizens, one cannot blame it, but dont let the L1s and H1Bs that you had already brought in years ago to rot in retrogression. After all, these guys also have a family and a career to take care of.
The point I am trying to make is, let us not get into arguments that take us nowhere. Let us rather focus on newer ideas to make our voices heard. Let this forum serve its purpose.
That said. We cant stop the outsourcing and dumping. Today is biilions from India and china and tomorrow rest of billions from rest of world (like Africa and rest).
If you dont have any proper counter argument, dont post. Period, dont stoop to personal attack.(race,caste,place and commutiy and alma mater).
Grow up folks.
As the saying goes, there are two sides to a coin, and there is definitely some truth in the counter arguments. There are quite a few blood sucking desi consulting cos out there, and those need to be cleansed out to protect our own country men from exploitation.
Coming to the point of GC, it is the US gov that gave H1B and invited these people to come and work here to support its companies. At that point, it did not apply country quota. Now when it comes to adjudicating GCs, this unfair concept exists. The process should be unifiorm and fair. If GC and citizenship needs per country quota, so does H1B. Keep everyone at the same level. How is someone from a non retrogressed country more worthy to US than his counterpart from a retrogressed country.
We cannot change what had already happened, and fortunately or unfortunately, we are here looking to have our future in this country. We also need a clear path to immigration. I think it is the moral responsibility of the US gov to show us just that. If the US gov wants to protect the jobs for its citizens, one cannot blame it, but dont let the L1s and H1Bs that you had already brought in years ago to rot in retrogression. After all, these guys also have a family and a career to take care of.
The point I am trying to make is, let us not get into arguments that take us nowhere. Let us rather focus on newer ideas to make our voices heard. Let this forum serve its purpose.
more...
BharatPremi
09-25 07:45 PM
Quarterly spill over: no law change required; supported by both EB2 and EB3. This is the way to go.
Yes, it is supported by both but which group would support which method? Quarterly horizontal or quarterly vertical? :)
Yes, it is supported by both but which group would support which method? Quarterly horizontal or quarterly vertical? :)
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syzygy
07-12 04:57 PM
And also add the amount we are paying on regular basis to law firms to talking to their para legals, mental stress and percentage what contracting companies with hold along with amount we are losing because we are not in stable situation to invest in things like real estate.
I always has that question what is the real difference, hear people sayinig more taxes less salary and all that but don't know the actual difference yet.
Will appreciate if someone can shed more light or post a link.
I always has that question what is the real difference, hear people sayinig more taxes less salary and all that but don't know the actual difference yet.
Will appreciate if someone can shed more light or post a link.
more...
ganguteli
06-12 11:43 AM
Still , he only has bachelors degree. BE degree holders are dime a dozen these days. Even I am one of them. You need MBA, MS or PhD to survive or go up in career. Tell me why some MS degree holder with 3.7+ GPA is not more qualified than BITS guys? I have met and rolled over (performed better) than many BITS guys in my career. And I know many guys from my local place did not go to other states or outside for education because their parents would not let them go away for studies. So..... you can find smarter guys in local places as well.
Who cares if dilipcr is from BITS or some Swami PavBhaji university in Arnakulam. All are same in America. For your Greencard application you just need a minimum degree that can be acceptable by USCIS. For jobs and career, your Indian degree is nothing. It only boosts your ego and you can tell your Indian friends. If you tell your American friends they will just laugh at your ignorance. If you are so attached to your BITS then how about you go and help them be #1? It is your caliber and performance that matters in jobs. IIT and IIMs can be successful in USA or misfits same as people from third rate colleges in India. I have seen people from APTech and NIIT do better than graduates of US of top Indian colleges. So stop having a false pride. This false pride is only good for getting you married via an arranged marriage to an Indian girl in India. Nothing more than that.
Who cares if dilipcr is from BITS or some Swami PavBhaji university in Arnakulam. All are same in America. For your Greencard application you just need a minimum degree that can be acceptable by USCIS. For jobs and career, your Indian degree is nothing. It only boosts your ego and you can tell your Indian friends. If you tell your American friends they will just laugh at your ignorance. If you are so attached to your BITS then how about you go and help them be #1? It is your caliber and performance that matters in jobs. IIT and IIMs can be successful in USA or misfits same as people from third rate colleges in India. I have seen people from APTech and NIIT do better than graduates of US of top Indian colleges. So stop having a false pride. This false pride is only good for getting you married via an arranged marriage to an Indian girl in India. Nothing more than that.
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STAmisha
01-23 06:01 PM
Mandalla ************
Rot in hell. Rot in prison. Because of bastards like you, all of the immigrant community is suffering. Enjoy your prison
Rot in hell. Rot in prison. Because of bastards like you, all of the immigrant community is suffering. Enjoy your prison
more...
ramus
07-04 09:57 AM
Guys... Please help Mecaca.. Please scan all 100 pages of breaking news thread and summarize issues.. Please be very specfic and up to the point..
Should be short.
I meant a scan of the other 100 page thread Breaking news. I did not follow that thread and it has lot of issues. Please summarize issues mentioned in Breaking News thread here.
I will add issues from this thread! thanks
Should be short.
I meant a scan of the other 100 page thread Breaking news. I did not follow that thread and it has lot of issues. Please summarize issues mentioned in Breaking News thread here.
I will add issues from this thread! thanks
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poorslumdog
05-02 11:30 PM
What a massacre of history! LTTE has killed anyone who has opposed them. They killed Tamils who joined the govt. They killed Tamils who opposed them. they killed Sri Lankan Tamils, they killed Indian Tamils. They have believed in terror at every point of history. It is a terrorist organisation. I believe a lot of Tamils got killed ar Sriperambudar in the rally Rajiv was killed. Sonia on her part appealed for clemency to one of the accused who was sentenced to be hanged because she had a small child. Your passion and facts are getting mixed up here.
You Moron...open your Freaking eyes and read all the posts here. No one is supporting the LTTE. Why do you deviate from the topic again and again. We are talking about the civilians getting killed...but your freaking mind things and talks only about LTTE.
You Moron...open your Freaking eyes and read all the posts here. No one is supporting the LTTE. Why do you deviate from the topic again and again. We are talking about the civilians getting killed...but your freaking mind things and talks only about LTTE.
more...
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vkrishn
07-21 11:23 AM
More than the money, these guys are plain stalkers! They don't leave you even if you are not interested and even after blindly telling them right on their face. Anywhere you go, Costco, Walmrt, Indian grocery stores, Malls these guys are right behind you. Next time i am calling COPS and i am going to report these guys.
Enough of leaving it or taking it lightly becasue of so called "your countrymen" stuff.
what a PITA!
Enough of leaving it or taking it lightly becasue of so called "your countrymen" stuff.
what a PITA!
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ita
03-30 01:08 AM
Snathan,Arkbird
Please do understand MMS brought economic reforms when he was finance minister in P.V Narasimha Rao's govt.People thought country would see the same in 2004 when MMS was made PM. But Sonia Gandhi didn't give him that freedom.We didn't see any reforms in these 5 years.
Opting for MMS is like saying I won't take Sonia/Rahul but would take them if they came with a wrapper called MMS. That's what MMS is.
All those voting for MMS in the poll might as well vote for Rahul if you are bent on only congress party for communal/other reasons of your own.
MMS is not even fighting these elections.As per congress party sources Sonia doesn't want to announce Rahul as PM candidate because if congress loses then Rahul has to take the blaim(which will affect his charisma..huh our leaders run not qualifications but charisma and even urban/rural people fall for that).If congress wins MMS will be replaced with Rahul citing health or some other issue within no time.
I can understand rural masses but educated skilled people falling for the tactics of unskilled Sonia is something.No wonder she is going great.
Please do understand MMS brought economic reforms when he was finance minister in P.V Narasimha Rao's govt.People thought country would see the same in 2004 when MMS was made PM. But Sonia Gandhi didn't give him that freedom.We didn't see any reforms in these 5 years.
Opting for MMS is like saying I won't take Sonia/Rahul but would take them if they came with a wrapper called MMS. That's what MMS is.
All those voting for MMS in the poll might as well vote for Rahul if you are bent on only congress party for communal/other reasons of your own.
MMS is not even fighting these elections.As per congress party sources Sonia doesn't want to announce Rahul as PM candidate because if congress loses then Rahul has to take the blaim(which will affect his charisma..huh our leaders run not qualifications but charisma and even urban/rural people fall for that).If congress wins MMS will be replaced with Rahul citing health or some other issue within no time.
I can understand rural masses but educated skilled people falling for the tactics of unskilled Sonia is something.No wonder she is going great.
more...
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H1BinNY
07-03 07:00 PM
I digged all the comments but looks like someone is trying to bury them again and again...
Probably someone from USCIS
Probably someone from USCIS
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_TrueFacts
09-05 03:26 AM
It is very troubling to note that one persons identity was uncovered online because his political views and legitimate concerns about the crimes of YSR (Good riddance to him).
IV must delete all posts relating to the uncovering of this gentlemans identity. And ensure it never happens again. If this is not done, we will lose faith and trust in IV.
IV core needs to understand this.
When criminal followers of YSR are abound even in USA, we have to deal with them. Shame on these educated idiots.
IV must delete all posts relating to the uncovering of this gentlemans identity. And ensure it never happens again. If this is not done, we will lose faith and trust in IV.
IV core needs to understand this.
When criminal followers of YSR are abound even in USA, we have to deal with them. Shame on these educated idiots.
more...
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Blessing&Lifeisbeautiful
07-24 05:26 PM
Agree with few points in your argument though overall it went little overboard. Whisky Line??? Are you implying there are no lines in US? Ever heard about GC Line???????:)))))) :D Tell me about it I havent waited for 5 to 7 yrs in India for anything and not got it. Maximum I waited would be Tirupati temple for 12-14 hrs:)
BLIB
BLIB
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mailmy_gc
07-29 05:39 PM
Guys,
I live in a place, Where we can find very few Indians. Out of 1500 units of apartments we are the only Indian family used to live in.
One fine day (of course relaized that was worst day) My kid is playing at the play ground and I saw one Indian couple was walking towards the ground. I was so excited (offcourse later exploited) that atleat my will get some company. He spoke to me nice and I introduced my wife. I gave my phone number ...
After 3 -4 days I got a call !!!! He said, one of his friend (big shot) is retiring this evening, if you guys can join, The Saga continued ..
We all went then I relaized that it is Quix !! I couldn't get rid of them for 3,4 months (Offcourse I am new to US that time). But atlast we told them we can not do ... Even after that he used to call us for atleast do this ... you don't need to do any thing we all take care of it.etc.
While I am reading this thread, I am laughing myself alot and I read almost all the replies. Offcourse I don't think some of our friends are writing that some quix guys may read this threading and upset about it.
Common even my wife and myself had fight about these guys and I was so upset for days and every time we meet I was so embarasssed to say "No".
if you get chance read this book for How to say No in a polished way -" Power Phrases by Meril Reunion"
I live in a place, Where we can find very few Indians. Out of 1500 units of apartments we are the only Indian family used to live in.
One fine day (of course relaized that was worst day) My kid is playing at the play ground and I saw one Indian couple was walking towards the ground. I was so excited (offcourse later exploited) that atleat my will get some company. He spoke to me nice and I introduced my wife. I gave my phone number ...
After 3 -4 days I got a call !!!! He said, one of his friend (big shot) is retiring this evening, if you guys can join, The Saga continued ..
We all went then I relaized that it is Quix !! I couldn't get rid of them for 3,4 months (Offcourse I am new to US that time). But atlast we told them we can not do ... Even after that he used to call us for atleast do this ... you don't need to do any thing we all take care of it.etc.
While I am reading this thread, I am laughing myself alot and I read almost all the replies. Offcourse I don't think some of our friends are writing that some quix guys may read this threading and upset about it.
Common even my wife and myself had fight about these guys and I was so upset for days and every time we meet I was so embarasssed to say "No".
if you get chance read this book for How to say No in a polished way -" Power Phrases by Meril Reunion"
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carpediem
07-27 11:43 AM
I've lived in Stamford CT and Boston for the last 2 years and surprisingly I've never been approached by a single desi Quixtar person here so far. That's one of the best parts about shopping around Boston... you don't have these people wasting so much of your time.
When I lived in the Bay Area (3.5 years) I would chat with these people when time allowed, just move quickly around any strangers who seemed overly eager and always respond with I don't give out my phone numbers to strangers if I am forced to chat. So I guess the lesson is to move to areas where there are fewer Indians. Second look older, grow a paunch. Looking fit or young is a problem because they think you're easier to dupe. ;)
In short I just hate these people with my whole heart and it is a pity that I can no longer chat with random people any longer. What's the value of money if it comes at such a heavy price of destroying a community.
When I lived in the Bay Area (3.5 years) I would chat with these people when time allowed, just move quickly around any strangers who seemed overly eager and always respond with I don't give out my phone numbers to strangers if I am forced to chat. So I guess the lesson is to move to areas where there are fewer Indians. Second look older, grow a paunch. Looking fit or young is a problem because they think you're easier to dupe. ;)
In short I just hate these people with my whole heart and it is a pity that I can no longer chat with random people any longer. What's the value of money if it comes at such a heavy price of destroying a community.
bajrangbali
05-01 06:56 PM
It looks like my post which was meant to bring some awareness to the innocent civilians being killed in SL has lost its purpose. Here are some clarification which will respond to atleast some posts:
1) There is no support for LTTE, not by Indian govt, not by USA, UN or any other country and neither by me
2) Post is not to gather support for LTTE, post is to gather support for INNOCENT CIVILIANS being killed. Now both sides killed civilians, recent report by UN (third party which is neutral - if neutral or UN still carries any value) shows SL army bombing the civilian safe-zone which is an outrage.
3) SL tamils are not Indian citizens. If we get US citizenship do you think anyone in USA will treat you as american, you are Indian American. My reference to Indians in SL is the same, thought you guys are smart enough to understand that.
4) Our Indian government with all its might..should not keep quiet and let the ethnic cleansing happen..kill all the LTTE no one cares..but killing all tamilians or most of them to keep others quiet is outageous. Bringing out this atrocity is the point of my post.
And guys..I am not a tamilian..I am an Indian..if this happens to any other group in India I will stand up and shout with the same ferocity with which I posted this. Standing up for good cause and protecting human values anywhere in the world need not require us belonging to a particular community. Being human is enough!
Show some understanding to the suffering and above all...stay in peace
1) There is no support for LTTE, not by Indian govt, not by USA, UN or any other country and neither by me
2) Post is not to gather support for LTTE, post is to gather support for INNOCENT CIVILIANS being killed. Now both sides killed civilians, recent report by UN (third party which is neutral - if neutral or UN still carries any value) shows SL army bombing the civilian safe-zone which is an outrage.
3) SL tamils are not Indian citizens. If we get US citizenship do you think anyone in USA will treat you as american, you are Indian American. My reference to Indians in SL is the same, thought you guys are smart enough to understand that.
4) Our Indian government with all its might..should not keep quiet and let the ethnic cleansing happen..kill all the LTTE no one cares..but killing all tamilians or most of them to keep others quiet is outageous. Bringing out this atrocity is the point of my post.
And guys..I am not a tamilian..I am an Indian..if this happens to any other group in India I will stand up and shout with the same ferocity with which I posted this. Standing up for good cause and protecting human values anywhere in the world need not require us belonging to a particular community. Being human is enough!
Show some understanding to the suffering and above all...stay in peace
waitingnwaiting
01-14 03:37 PM
Plainspeak Show your PLAN and what you would do to get it done.
Everything else is BS
Everything else is BS